Rookie or SA league

This topic contains 28 replies, has 16 voices, and was last updated by  Toluca KOR 6 years, 9 months ago.

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  • #3977
     Tocumen KOR 
    Spectator

    Why dont we have a rookie or S A league? I got to say developping young underdevelopped draftees is rather hard in this league. Poor performances have an effect on morale which further affects performances and development. I have so many players who started to fall apart barely a few sims after draft day, its depressing…

    Why not have a rookie or S A league for the really young guys?

  • #25922
     Moca DOM 
    Spectator

    We have had 3 leagues for all of existence. The development has nothing to do with the # of leagues, the game compensates, and ghost players are on. You don’t need 100 guys in your minors to develop them.

    IIRC the league was designed to be as complex or less complex as a guy wants it to be, so 3 levels was a happy medium.

  • #25860
     Tocumen KOR 
    Spectator

    development is related to player morale. If a player is overwhelmed by the competition and cannot perform, he will be angry and it will affect him further. It leads to ratings, potentials hits.

    If there were a R level, very young players would be facing their peers and would perform better. It would have a direct effect on morale and development. I am 100% sure 18 years old players wouldnt bust so often if they didnt have to face olders players in A level.

    Development isnt related to # of levels, its related to whom players are facing and if they can progress.

  • #25950
     Moca DOM 
    Spectator

    no not really. Development will equal out no matter how many levels you have. If you have the 5 levels it will just work differently then the 3.

    It’s been discussed in great detail on here before. We have 3 levels, it works, it always has and always will.

    Have a nice day.

  • #25951
     Vancouver CUB 
    Spectator

    You’re being unfairly dismissive Dan. Of course morale can affect development, and “that’s the way it’s always been” is pretty much the worst argument for anything ever.

    No reason we can’t have have a short A or rookie league if it’s easy to add. We wouldn’t even have to increase the # of players in our minors since we have ghost players. The only downside I can think of is it would increase the file size, which is already pretty damn big.

    I know that the Commish supports this, and I would like a place for my 17-18 year olds to play against other young’uns. This will be discussed for 2035.

  • #25952
     Moca DOM 
    Spectator

    I am dismissive of this b/c it’s an unnecessary gigantic change to a league which has been running without it for nearly 30 seasons. And it’s not even a “problem” with the league. It’s been argued about before.

    Morale of course has something to do with it, but to say this is only b/c of levels is incorrect. We have known for years that if you manage your minors correctly the players will develop. Hell even if you don’t manage them correctly they will still develop. There are teams who keep 80 players in A and those guys still develop.

    There is no reason to overhaul an existing system like this. THAT’s why I dismiss it. It’s just a been there done that. I tried to be nice the 1st time.

  • #25953
     Bocas del Toro VEN 
    Spectator

    I personally dont see adding a rookie league as a big deal. If its not too much work, why not? Its not really more work managing 3 minor league teams than 4, and if it doesnt help develop the younger prospects, no harm, no foul.

    I dont see it as a major change…

  • #25954
     Philadelphia USA 
    Spectator

    I don’t think adding a league will increase development. It will just give each team a place to stash 30 year old average players.. Run each league like they are independent and staff positions correctly. (Wining always counts) Not every 17 year old should be on the field..

  • #25955
     Vancouver CUB 
    Spectator

    @Philadelphia (DOM) wrote:

    I don’t think adding a league will increase development. It will just give each team a place to stash 30 year old average players.. Run each league like they are independent and staff positions correctly. (Wining always counts) Not every 17 year old should be on the field..

    If we did add a team we wouldn’t increase the 125 player limit for majors and minors. It would just mean increased playing time which definitely helps development, especially for fielding.

  • #25956
     Bocas del Toro VEN 
    Spectator

    @Philadelphia (DOM) wrote:

    I don’t think adding a league will increase development. It will just give each team a place to stash 30 year old average players.. Run each league like they are independent and staff positions correctly. (Wining always counts) Not every 17 year old should be on the field..

    Personally I don’t have any prospects over 25 in my Minors…I have a few AAA guys that are emergency callups due to injury, but that’s about it. No need to flood my minors with guys who will never make it.

  • #25957
     Philadelphia USA 
    Spectator

    Just an opinion.. The morale part of the game is enhanced when you have kids play with vets.. Not for everybody but you can’t roll out a 17 year old shortstop who can’t field and expect to not watch your young pitchers regress…

  • #25958
     Oaxaca JPN 
    Spectator

    I am up for bringing in another minor league level.

    How about putting up a voting thread, and see what occurs.

    Just my two cents…

  • #25959
     Santiago de Cuba USA 
    Spectator

    I don’t really see the need for it. That’s just more players to manage. It also gives people like me more of an excuse to grab average 30 years olds and stash them away for a rainy day.

    Have you guys seen my minor leagues lately? I’ve become a hoarder. This would only further my addiction.

  • #25960
     Erie VEN 
    Spectator

    Bob, they already stated that they wouldn’t want to increase the limit on total players in the organization. You wouldn’t be able to acquire more talent, just able to give the talent you already have more playing time.

    I don’t know if the arguments presented on either side are true or not, but I have noticed a lot of my first and second round picks dropping in talent the last few years. Maybe it’s just random, maybe it’s because my system sucks at developing talent, or maybe it’s because my guys are playing against systems with more talent and are getting overwhelmed. I don’t know, but I’m not opposed to adding another level.

  • #25961
     Busan CUB 
    Spectator

    my only question would be how many leagues do you add? even after you add on more league the argument can be had to add another aswell for the same reasons. I love more teams to try and manage and since we allow 125 players and ml team allows 25 per team… so 4 team for minors would allow you to have 25 per team. maybe we can add player limits per minor team aswell? and maybe recognize the winners of the minor leagues.?

  • #25962
     Santiago de Cuba USA 
    Spectator

    125 players includes the majors.

  • #25964
     Moca DOM 
    Spectator

    @Erie (JPN) wrote:

    Bob, they already stated that they wouldn’t want to increase the limit on total players in the organization. You wouldn’t be able to acquire more talent, just able to give the talent you already have more playing time.

    I don’t know if the arguments presented on either side are true or not, but I have noticed a lot of my first and second round picks dropping in talent the last few years. Maybe it’s just random, maybe it’s because my system sucks at developing talent, or maybe it’s because my guys are playing against systems with more talent and are getting overwhelmed. I don’t know, but I’m not opposed to adding another level.

    This is more due to the power creep that has erupted in the league and the game compensating so there isnt as many 999 in everyone’s minors.

    You will likely see just as many bumps over the next few years being the drafts have consistently been crappy in the last few years. This keeps everything in a relative balance.

  • #25965
     Bocas del Toro VEN 
    Spectator

    I would mind a 4th Minor League, only because with 100 Minor Leaguers, I always seem to have 40% or more in Single A, which obviously ends up with a ton of guys not getting much playing time. I try and make sure my best prospects are playing full time, but it’d be nice to split the 40 or so guys into Single A and Rookie Ball.

    If it’s a lot of work for the Commish, it’s not a big deal either way for me, but I’d prefer 4 Minor League levels if it’s an option.

  • #25966
     Busan CUB 
    Spectator

    why not add another level or reduce the player amounts down to 100 players per organization?

  • #25967
     Tijuana VEN 
    Spectator

    What would stop a team from playing older players in the rookie league? I think it is assume that only rookies would be playing at that level of competition, but that doesn’t necessarily have to be the case. You could see more mature players playing in rookie ball, and again affecting player performance, moral, and ultimately potentially development.

    I don’t see a need to change, but if one more level was added I wouldn’t mind it. I am not in favor of lower the overall player cap. I think 125 is perfect.

  • #25968
     Changsha JPN 
    Spectator

    I think 3 minor league levels are fine. I’m open to change.
    One argument I’ve heard is we need a lower level with a age limit. Not sure if that is possible.
    The other argument is their is a need for another league so all your players can get playing time. This could be solved by cutting the number of player you have yourself or reducing the 125 player limit. I think 125 is perfect.

  • #25969
     Busan CUB 
    Spectator

    ya I only mentioned the dropping to 100 as a way to not have to add another league but as a compromise … again the board of directors will do whats best for the best league period!

  • #25975
     Barquisimeto CAN 
    Spectator

    @Busan (CUB) wrote:

    ya I only mentioned the dropping to 100 as a way to not have to add another league but as a compromise … again the board of directors will do whats best for the best league period!

    Nothing is stopping you from dropping your total amount of guys to 100. I’m quite happy running 125 guys through 4 leagues.

  • #25989
     Santurce de CAN 
    Spectator

    I can take it or leave it but if we did add a league I would make the following changes:

    No organizational limit
    35 player team roster limit
    Age limits on league levels
    15 round draft

    I think using age limits instead of organizational limits makes sense even if a league isn’t added. Just make 35 player roster limits and an age limit. No one would have to monitor organizational roster size and we already monitor the DL’s so it would be hard to stash players.

    **EDIT**

    I just read that they removed the setting for age limits because the AI couldn’t manage it effectively. So…. disregard I guess.

  • #26063
     Hong Kong CUB 
    Spectator

    @santurce de (CUB) wrote:

    I can take it or leave it but if we did add a league I would make the following changes:

    No organizational limit
    35 player team roster limit
    Age limits on league levels
    15 round draft

    I think using age limits instead of organizational limits makes sense even if a league isn’t added. Just make 35 player roster limits and an age limit. No one would have to monitor organizational roster size and we already monitor the DL’s so it would be hard to stash players.

    **EDIT**

    I just read that they removed the setting for age limits because the AI couldn’t manage it effectively. So…. disregard I guess.

    Hmm…there are minor league settings for roster limit? This could actually be a way for us to avoid having to check organizational player limits. (The board is right now looking at ways to reduce rule checking, because its more work than you think, and it never ends…)

    On the topic at hand, I personally don’t care how many minor leagues we have (I definitely see the value of having a place to develop 17 year-old prospects with current ratings of like 2/1/2/1/1 because I find they hit about .115 at A), but I’m wary about adding as well, given that we tried to move to OOTP’s new “associations” feature a while back and it resulted in a corrupted game file that inconvenienced us for a bit.

    I’m going to bring this up with the board to discuss, even though a few board members have already posted here. But the board has 3-4 other unresolved issues which I am going to work to resolve in the next week or two first.

  • #26066
     Mexico City DOM 
    Spectator

    I’ll just chime in on a couple of things…

    I don’t understand why there are ‘unlimited’ roster sizes in the minors in the first place. Adding a fourth level would not impact anything and would take very little additional time. The other league I’m in has four levels – with roster limits on all, without ghosts, and I don’t find myself spending that much more on it; we actually cap the SA at 35.

    Another thing that perplexes me is everyones concern here about the file size. the WBH takes half the time to DL for me as my other league, and I never thought twice about – before or now. I’ve never heard a complaint either. Oddly enough, if I have to DL manually, the WBH file takes considerably longer, so perhaps that’s what people are referring to.

  • #26069
     Erie VEN 
    Spectator

    @Mexico City (JPN) wrote:

    Oddly enough, if I have to DL manually, the WBH file takes considerably longer, so perhaps that’s what people are referring to.

    That’s because the only manual download we have is the “full league file”. My other leagues have a “full league file” and a skimped down file that doesn’t include images (and probably some other non-essential things). A full file will always take a lot longer than a skimped down version (which is probably what your other leagues have available on their sites).

  • #26072
     Mexico City DOM 
    Spectator

    @Erie (JPN) wrote:

    @Mexico City (JPN) wrote:

    Oddly enough, if I have to DL manually, the WBH file takes considerably longer, so perhaps that’s what people are referring to.

    That’s because the only manual download we have is the “full league file”. My other leagues have a “full league file” and a skimped down file that doesn’t include images (and probably some other non-essential things). A full file will always take a lot longer than a skimped down version (which is probably what your other leagues have available on their sites).

    Nope, full file, I believe.

  • #26074
     Toluca KOR 
    Spectator

    We have had file size and download time issues in the past.

    And “one more minor league level” means 56 more teams!

    I think that OOTP 14 is better on the FTP front than past versions, and additionally most of us are on better connections than we may have been in the past, so it may not be a huge issue anymore, but bear in mind that it once was, and could be again.

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